There is a major deception in American culture that public schools are nonreligious. When tenets of Christianity were booted from the public school system decades ago, tenets of humanism filled the void. One of those tenets is the evolutionary worldview, including biological, geological, and cosmological evolution. The evolutionary worldview is a religious belief, but while it can be labeled as “science” in our culture, it wins a free pass for government endorsement. I challenged several humanists on this point in a debate on the Friendly Atheist Facebook page. As demonstrated by the humanists' reactions to my challenge, the evolutionary worldview is a “sacred cow” for humanists.
In Part 3 of the debate, humanist JD claimed that evolution is a “secure fact in science” and tried to compare the evolutionary worldview to the “germ theory of disease.” I refuted this false equivocation by pointing out the fact that germs are observable, but evolution is not. A little while later in the debate thread, JD responded with a longer comment, and I provided a point-by-point rebuttal. Below is Part 5 of 6 of the Humanism as Religion debate.
JD:
I appreciate you being civil Kevin. I love civil debate, but in the case of evolution, there is no debate. The argument is over. It's been confirmed and verified by every field of science. In genealogy, the most impressive work was actually done by a Christian, one Dr. Frances Collins, the director of the National Institute of Health. We can demonstrate, conclusively, by every standard of science, that all forms of life on earth are cousins sharing a common ancestor.
As for answers in genesis, and not trying to sound high and mighty here, but I am not going to waste my time with any more of their nonsense. These people believe a literal global flood occurred due to their god feeling the need to commit genocide, they reject many of the now established facts in science, and believe the Earth is less than 10,000 years old.
If you want a very light start into scientific truth, you can read the aforementioned christian Dr. Collins' book The Language of God, in which he tries to square his Christian faith with the facts his team discovered while decoding our DNA. One of these facts was we can demonstrate with CERTAINTY that our species has existed for at least 100,000 years or more. Anyway, best of luck in your search for the truth.
Me:
[JD], I am splitting up my response in segments for clarity:
“I appreciate you being civil Kevin. I love civil debate…”
Thanks [JD], I appreciate you being civil as well, and maintaining respectful dialogue.
“…but in the case of evolution, there is no debate. The argument is over.”
This is begging the question. It’s like saying “evolution must be true because it is a fact.” Your conclusion is a restatement of your premise…this is technically not “invalid,” but it is arbitrary.
“It's been confirmed and verified by every field of science.”
If this is the case, then how has life evolving from non-life ever been “confirmed” or “verified”? Who ever observed this? Who has ever directly observed an originally flight-less organism evolve the ability to fly? Who has ever directly observed an originally blind organism evolve eyesight? Who has ever directly observed an ape-like creature evolve into a man?
“In genealogy, the most impressive work was actually done by a Christian, one Dr. Frances Collins, the director of the National Institute of Health. We can demonstrate, conclusively, by every standard of science, that all forms of life on earth are cousins sharing a common ancestor.”
That is impossible to demonstrate, because nobody was around for the supposed millions/billions of years to observe all forms of life descend from a common ancestor. This is also a conflation of verifiable, observational science and unverifiable historical science. We can observe the present-day circumstantial evidence of DNA similarity…but we can’t observe the supposed millions of years of biological evolution. If you are trying to argue that DNA similarity between organisms proves a common ancestor, then that argument commits the logical fallacy of Affirming the Consequent. The argument says this:
1. If all forms of life on earth share a common ancestor, then we would expect to see DNA similarity among all forms of life.
2. We see DNA similarity among all forms of life.
3. Therefore, all forms of life on earth share a common ancestor.
This is similar to saying “if it is snowing, then it must be cold outside…it is cold outside…therefore, it must be snowing.” Obviously, just because it’s cold outside does not mean that it is snowing. Likewise, just because we observe DNA similarity does not automatically mean common ancestry. Creation scientists also expect to observe DNA similarity between humans, apes, and other organisms due to a common Creator/Designer. Using the biblical worldview, God designed organisms with many of the same proteins as building blocks. As Dr. Georgia Purdom (PhD, Molecular Genetics) points out:
“Much of the similarity lies in the regions of the DNA that result in proteins (the genes). It seems logical that if a protein performs a certain function in an organism, and that function is necessary in other organisms, then the same protein would be utilized by multiple organisms. Just as paintings from the same painter look similar, so do the proteins (and thus, genes) from a variety of organisms designed by a common Designer” (https://answersingenesis.org/.../are-humans-and-chimps.../).
“As for answers in genesis, and not trying to sound high and mighty here, but I am not going to waste my time with any more of their nonsense. These people believe a literal global flood occurred due to their god feeling the need to commit genocide, they reject many of the now established facts in science, and believe the Earth is less than 10,000 years old.”
This is circular reasoning, or begging the question. Your position that Answers in Genesis material is “nonsense” is based on the conclusion that the biblical history of biology, geology, cosmology, etc., is untrue. Yet, your premise is that this biblical history is untrue while evolution is true. Your premise and your conclusion are the same. There’s nothing inherently invalid about a premise matching a conclusion, but the argument is arbitrary. Also, I see that you lament the idea that God supposedly felt the “…need to commit genocide.” I assume you are charging the God of the Bible with a moral wrongdoing. In your atheistic, evolutionary worldview, by what ultimate standard do you judge that God was unrighteous in His judgment? In your atheistic, evolutionary worldview, if people are just material…if you and I are no more valuable than a jar of mayonnaise, then what does it matter if people die?
“If you want a very light start into scientific truth, you can read the aforementioned christian Dr. Collins' book The Language of God, in which he tries to square his Christian faith with the facts his team discovered while decoding our DNA.”
In reality, Dr. Collins tries to “reconcile” two different religions: Christianity and humanism. Dr. Collins observed circumstantial evidence in the present, but he did not live for millions of years to observe biological evolution from a common ancestor. His belief about the past is based on faith, not observation.
“One of these facts was we can demonstrate with CERTAINTY that our species has existed for at least 100,000 years or more.”
Who has lived for 100,000 years to directly test and verify this conclusion? All we have is circumstantial evidence in the present. The best way to know about the past is to seek historical documentation from reliable witnesses. For the Christian, the ultimate trustworthy witness is God Himself, who told us about the past in His Word.
“Anyway, best of luck in your search for the truth.”
Thank you for the kind statement. I grew up believing in a generic “God,” but not the God of the Bible. Therefore, I lived as a humanist in the pragmatic sense. I decided what was right and wrong in my own eyes. However, a little over 7 years ago, I searched for the Truth…the Truth, who is Jesus, found me. On the surface, that may seem arbitrary, but my personal testimony is evidence: my claim is that I was supernaturally changed…I was given a new “heart” and a new spirit. I am not perfect, but I am no longer a slave to sin…I am free in Christ. “Jesus said to him, ‘I am the way, and the truth, and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me.’”—John 14:6
I did not see any further replies from JD when I checked the thread up to two days after the last set of comments. JD’s last point provided a convenient segue to sharing the Gospel. The Gospel is the root of my passion for this ministry. The evolutionary worldview causes a major stumbling block by causing people to doubt the truthfulness and authority of God’s Word, especially the Gospel’s foundation in Genesis. Consequently, I am passionate about unmasking the humanistic tenets biological, geological, and cosmological evolution, and defending God’s Word in Genesis.
In Part 6 of 6 of the debate, humanist PK seems to confess a shortcoming of the evolutionary worldview. I will share that in my next post.